OneCircle USA Talks with Ramakant Maharaj Part II September 16, 2016
September 16, 2016
OneCircle Silver Spring, USA
Because you’re Master of mind! So far mind was dictating us “do this thing, do that thing”, now we are dictating to the mind. It can happen. Mind, ego, intellect, these are only functioning organs. And after having Conviction you will be thoughtless, no thoughts will be there. And therefore for which, again I am repeating, meditation is the base, the foundation, which you are neglecting, you are not knowing.
Q: Maharaj, why are we so scared to find this Ultimate Truth?
Maharaj: Not like that. Because we are having so many concepts engraved upon us we are having some strong concepts: ‘I am somebody else’, ‘man’ or ‘woman’. And to dissolve all these concepts, again, you have to undergo the meditation. After having the Conviction that ‘I am not the body at all, I was not the body at all, I’m not going to remain the body at all, I am unborn, death and birth are connected with the body only, all desires are connected with the body only”. You are beyond that. So there won’t be any depression, there won’t be any negative thoughts. It is not your fault. Because since childhood till today we’ve had a long association with the body, thousands of concepts have been engraved upon us. And we are trying to live within the circle of those concepts, we are having some limitation. Our thinking process is also within the circle of limitation, ‘I am somebody else’, ‘I am a man or woman, somebody else’.
Q2: If all of us are Brahmans, the Brahma itself, is that correct? That’s the premise? Is that we are all…
Maharaj: It’s a fact! You’re measuring yourself in body-form! Bodies are different, bodies are different…
Q2: No problem, so that’s the premise. So the question that is begged is: why is one Brahma willing to harm another Brahma if we are one and the same?
Maharaj: Because it is body-based knowledge. Brahma is not harming anything. Is the sky harming any sky? American sky is harming some Indian sky? Sky doesn’t know ‘I am sky’, Presence doesn’t know ‘I am Presence,’ Brahman does not know ‘I am Brahman’. Brahman is a word given to that Ultimate Truth that you are. The Invisible Listener within you is Ultimate Truth, it is called Brahman, Atman, Paramatman, God, Master. It is not an individual, there’s no duality at all.
Q2: So then can one say that it’s okay for this Brahman to harm this Brahman?
Maharaj: No, no, no “Okay I am Brahman I will harm another Brahman”, there’s no two different Brahman.
Q2: Okay, so it’s one Brahman, right, but bodies, there are two separate bodies. If I harm this body in some way do I just turn around and say it’s okay because we’re all one and the same?
Maharaj: Egoistic concepts are there, ‘I am somebody else’. That ‘somebody’ is supposed to be dissolved. Brahman is not harming anybody else.
Q2: But if harm should happen, which you, I think, said earlier, was that nothing is really being done, no deeds are being done, ultimately.
Maharaj: There’s no doer there’s no deed. So far we’re measuring ourselves in body-form, all these concepts appear. I’m talking about that invisible Presence within you, where nothing is there, no thoughts are there, no concepts are there. The concept ‘Brahman’ is also not there. And as I told, the name ‘Brahman’ is given to that Ultimate Truth. Except your Selfless Self there is no Brahman, Atman, Paramatman, God, Master. So Brahman is not harming some other, “this Brahman is different, this Brahman is different”.
Q2: Okay, so in other words, what you do to others you’re doing to yourself, right?
Maharaj: So far you’re considering yourself in body-form these concepts appear. No other is there. Because we are measuring in body-form, therefore ‘he’ is there, ‘he’, ‘she’, ‘it’ is there, and all concepts appear. Prior to beingness any of these things are there? Prior beingness or after leaving the body, are you finding any different things?
Q2: So, somebody who does do harm to another…
Maharaj: When did you come across with somebody? Prior to beingness who ‘somebody’ was there?
After leaving body any ‘somebody’ is there?
Q2: …body, body, if this body harms…
Maharaj: (Smiling) I’m shouting…I’m shouting at you…because you’re measuring yourself in body-form therefore you say different bodies are there. Different houses are there, sky is one. This is called a bungalow, this is a cottage, something, something, names are given. If all the houses collapse what happens to the sky? Is it going to hell or heaven? And therefore I’m telling you not to measure yourself in body-form, it’s the basic thing. Since we are measuring ourselves in body-form, so many concepts appear. Bodies are different. After one hundred years what will happen to all these bodies? Even if you think intellectually – how were you prior to one hundred years, you say “I don’t know”, your answer will be: “I don’t know”. How are you after one hundred years – “I don’t know”. ‘I don’t know’ means “I’m not in any form, not in any shape”. As I told some of you: You’re alone in the house, and somebody knocks on the door “Anybody there?”, you say “Nobody’s there”. Correct? You want to say “I am here, except myself nobody’s there”, that’s the only thing. Except your Selfless Self, nothing is there.
And therefore I am insisting on meditation. Meditation means concentration, full involvement. For which there are no restrictions, no bondage is there. This is the base, foundation. Because only listening is meaningless, it is a temporary relief, painkillers. Temporary intoxication.
The human body is an opportunity for you to identify yourself. Every moment is very important, it’s valuable. Complete concentration, complete involvement is most important. We’re not accepting it. Everybody knows ‘I am not body at all’, everybody knows. Some or other day, willingly or unwillingly we are to leave this body, what remains?
Q3: Could you please say something about any practice that is silent, without words, that supports the aware Presence in recognizing itself?
Maharaj: After having Conviction, silence will be there, spontaneous silence is there. Therefore I am insisting on meditation. Because, there is no silence because we are having so many concepts, body-based concepts. Directly or indirectly we’ve become a victim of our mind, ego, intellect. For which you have to identify yourself in a real sense. It’s fact, forget about spirituality. You were not the body at all, you’re not the body, you’re not going to remain the body, the body is not your identity at all. Even if you think intellectually, it’s open fact. What is the value of this body? If there is no Presence for a moment, what is the value of this body? Nothing. And therefore I am insisting on meditation all the time, involvement. Considering the sensitivity of the Spirit or Presence, the words are given ‘Soham’ or some ‘Aham Brahmasmi’, ‘Sivoham, these are the words. Key-words, you see, key-words.
Q4: Naam (inaudible) should be recited continuously at all times once one has received initiation?
Maharaj: You have to recite the Naam Mantra all the time continuously, at any moment. You need not sit all the time here like this (Maharaj pretends to meditate). You do your job, do your duties, no restrictions, no bondage is there. What you are doing, whatever you are doing, you recite the Mantra, the Naam Mantra, ‘Aham Brahmasmi’, ‘Brahman I am, Brahman’, like that.
Q4: And it will still the mind so that the mind is not all over the place all the time.
Maharaj: Mind is always pricking from the backside. When you’re concentrating on the Mantra, concentrating on ‘Brahman’, it’s a kind of cleaning process. Mind will not allow you to concentrate on yourself. Mind is nothing but the flow of thoughts. We are giving importance to the mind – there’s no mind at all, no mind, ego, intellect. They came along with the body only, they appeared upon your Presence. If your Presence is not there, where is the mind, ego, intellect? But directly or indirectly we are becoming victims of the mind, ego, intellect. We are giving so much importance to mind, ego, intellects: “Not to go against my mind”.
Q2: May I ask another question?
Maharaj: Yes, yes, ask a question.
Q2: I (inaudible) with Vipassana meditation, which does not involve mantras, it is basically observing your breath, observing your body sensations. What are your thoughts on that?
Maharaj: This is a temporary relief. ‘Vipassana’, so many concepts are there. Temporary relief. So far you are doing Vipassana for a time, one week, two week, one month, after leaving the Vipassana again you come to the same place.
Q2: But what if you practice Vipassana everyday? I mean, what are your thoughts on Vipassana versus…
Maharaj: The Principle behind Vipassana or any practice is just do identify yourself in a real sense. Whatever practice you are doing, is just for the principle that you identify yourself in a real sense. This is only a process: Vipassana is a process, meditation is also a process. But meditation is a strong process through which you can identify yourself as early as possible.
Q2: But in Vipassana meditation there is no mantra…
Maharaj: You (go ahead and) do Vipassana meditation, but you are posing yourself in body-form and then doing some Vipassana meditation, so it is meaningless. “I am somebody else, I’m doing Vipassana meditation”, it is egoistic meditation. You are to forget your body-identity. “I am doing some sadhana, I am doing some meditation” – that ‘I’ is supposed to be dissolved, for which meditation is there. Through meditation you are inviting the attention of the Invisible Meditator within you that you are Ultimate Truth, you are Final Truth. Non-stop hammering yourself. At the advanced stage, meditation is no longer required. After having Conviction, no meditation is required. Meditation is only a process for the time being., till you’ve got Conviction, Spontaneous Conviction.
Q5: In ‘I Am That’, Nisargadatta says “A quiet mind is all you need. When the mind is quiet, all else happens as it should.” Does it matter, therefore, how one quiets one’s mind?
Maharaj: It happens, but after knowing your Selfless Self the mind will not remain. The existence of mind appeared upon your Presence. The existence of mind, ego, intellect appeared upon your Presence. Presence does not have any mind, ego, intellect. And therefore, try to identify yourself in a real sense. These are the words, through words I am conveying. After having Conviction, mind, ego, intellect never remains. Where was the mind prior to beingness and after leaving the body? Mind does not have it’s own identity. You have given birth to the mind, ego, intellect. Without your Presence, how can you identify ego, intellect, mind? It was not there prior to beingness, and not after leaving the body also. And therefore I am insisting on meditation. Through meditation you can control your mind, mind will be controlled spontaneously. Mind means flow of thoughts, continuous thoughts are there, which you define as ‘the mind’. Thoughts are entering the mind, they go to the intellect and make a decision, and through ego you are implementing that decision. It’s a process, functioning. You are separate from that.
So all questions will be solved within you. You do not need to go anywhere or to any Master also, I’ll tell you. Because the Masterly essence is within you. My Master said: “I’m not making you a disciple, I’m making you a Master”. Nisargadatta Maharaj says that “I’m not making you a disciple, I’m making you a Master”. You’re already Master, but you forgot your identity.
You know the story of the lion? Famous story, spiritual story. One lion got brought up with the goats and sheep and started considering: “I am a goat or sheep” and was afraid of the dogs and foxes, etc., etc. It’s a famous story, you know? So far we have association with this body, even though body is not our identity, and therefore we are considering ourself in body-form. You are formless. There’s no shape, no form, it’s fact. And to absorb this fact, you are to undergo the meditation, again I am repeating the same thing. You may read books, you may listen to the various Masters, but not to neglect your Inner Master.
Any questions for anybody else? Yes?
Q6: I’m confused about when the best time to activate the inner Master and do the self-enquiry. Should that…
Maharaj: See, I said that ‘inner Master’ and ‘outer Master’ are concepts. There’s no difference between the internal Master and the external Master. Just for understanding we are saying ‘internal Master’, ‘external Master’, there’s no difference between any ‘internal Master’ and ‘external Master’. It’s just for understanding. Master is Master, there’s no inner and no outer, no external.
Q6: Thank you.
Q7: Who is eligible to have the Naam Mantra?
Q7: (inaudible)..requirement for that?
Maharaj: Yes, yes, I told John. If you are willing to have the Naam Mantra, spare some time for Naam Mantra. But it should be sincere. I’m not accepting anything from you, but you should be sincere to accept it, your involvement is most important. Because what happens, is that things we get free of charge have no value. I’m not expecting anything from you except your involvement, which is most important, not anything else. To give the Naam Mantra is not difficult for me. But there should not be some ill-faith or something. Be serious about the Naam Mantra.
Q7: How to practice it?
Maharaj: (Inaudible), (I’ll guide you). You are to recite the Mantra according to the breathing. At the initial stage we are giving some discipline, just like when you are learning some language, how to write a-b-c-d and all these things.
Q7: Because sometimes it feels we are torturing ourself.
Maharaj: It’s not necessary to torture yourself. It’s a very simple thing. No torturing, no special exercise. Why to torture the body? It’s a simple thing, it’s your knowledge, not the knowledge of ‘Brahman’, ‘Atman’, ‘Paramatman’. The Invisible Listener within you is Ultimate Truth, it is called Ultimate Truth. But you are neglecting it, you are underestimating yourself. You say “God is great”, “Oh God bless me”, okay, it’s not bad. But if your Presence is not there, how can you identify God?
To say ‘God’ your Presence is required. If there’s no Presence in the body, who will talk about the God? Who will talk about this world? At the initial stage I’m insisting on meditation because we forgot our identity. You might have read so many books, you might have listened to so many Masters. But you’re not reading, not listening as if it’s the listener’s story, the readers story, “It’s my story”. If somebody writes your biography, you“It’s my biography”.
Q8: You can also recite with an ‘Om Nama Sivaya’ or (other) mantra also?
Maharaj: You can recite one mantra, any one mantra. Not to take one mantra from one Master, go to another Master for some other mantra. Have some loyalty or faith with your mantra, any mantra will do. Not to (inaudible) wavering mind: “Today one Master gives this mantra then that Master gives a different Mantra”.
Q8: No, in the morning you have a habit of (inaudible), ten minutes…
Maharaj: Okay, no problem. With full faith, full involvement. Any mantra will do: ‘Aham Brahmasmi’ is okay, ‘Sivoham’, any mantra. But be faithful with full trust.
Q9: I’m kind of confused. When you say something comes…nothing comes from something, and then something becomes nothing?
Maharaj: I said that ‘everything came out of nothing, and everything dissolves back into nothing’. Everything came out of nothing and everything dissolves within nothing.
Q9: But how can something become nothing? And nothing become something, I mean…
Maharaj: We are playing with the words. Try to identify yourself so this question will not arise in your mind. These are the words, I repeat, this is language through which you are conveying yourself. We have created language: ‘something’, ‘nothing’, ‘everything’, these are words. The basic principle behind that is that you have to try to identify yourself, try to identify the Invisible Listener within you. Instead of analyzing so many words, spiritual words, try to identify: who is the analyzer? Who wants this knowledge? What is the purpose of this knowledge? To what extent is this knowledge helpful? Suppose somebody has lots of knowledge. Will that knowledge help at the time of leaving the body? Lots of knowledge, so many books you are reading, fifty years of sadhana, seventy years of sadhana, or something. Just question yourself: “After reading so many books, after having approached so many Masters, after having a lot of knowledge, will this knowledge help me at the time of leaving the body?” You should be fearless. That fearless life should be there. That moment should be a happy moment: “I am not dying, no death is there. I am unborn.”
You’ll get spontaneous courage out of spirituality to approach any problem. Thoughts are coming and going, negative thoughts are coming and going, depressions are there. But after having Conviction you’ll neglect all these depressive thoughts. It is momentary, just like clouds, black clouds coming and going. You are there and there only.
Yes? Anybody having any questions? I think tomorrow will be another session.